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Petition against the current economy system

Started by xandergcool, Jul 08, 2019, 08:26 am

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xandergcool

Hey all

Yesterday I was thinking back to all the nostalgic memories we all made on the previous server. What happened to suddenly cross my mind were all the chestshops in the Wild. So what did I do? I tried it. To my surprise this worked perfectly just like the old times.

Sadly enough I quickly received a mail stating this was not allowed.

I'm not writing this post to complain about the server, in fact, I am positively surprised about how the server, map and many other things have evolved into something amazing. A community where people can experience Pokémon in Minecraft like no-where else.

The only thing that is really disappointing me is the economy system. No more use of pokéshops except the SAME one in every village, with majorly overpriced items and un-usefull stuff. No more chestshopping in wilds, which used to support the community and add major value to the economy system. Currently there is just no supply and demand. I fully understand the server is still checking on how to approach some things, but just wanted to give my, and share other people's opinion on this matter.

xandergcool
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synderfin

Jul 08, 2019, 06:25 pm #1 Last Edit: Jul 08, 2019, 06:29 pm by synderfin
I'd say I'm in half agreement. I think it would be great to have ChestShops return to the Wild. I campaigned to have them included in houses at the very least. However, the major issue the admins are facing is trying to make it so these shops don't pollute the Wild with blank chests. They may have a solution with the ChestShop auto-breaking after they run out of stock though there is still the issue of people using them for safe storage for other items while the sold item can just be set at an unreasonably high price. I believe they are trying to solve these exploits right now and if they can be fixed then it is highly likely ChestShops will return to the Wild, around the /pvp spawn.

As for Pokemarts. The reason they were changed back to admin shops is because with the old system you had users own marts that they would end-up leaving to decay and run out of stock. This could maybe be solved with a rent-based system so owners would be encouraged to keep the store functioning??
Additionally was the issue of them not selling useful necessities for new users. Noobs often need stone weapons for a last minute gym fight, not blaze rods and nautilus shells. A balance between player stores in houses and the Wild, mixed with admin shops in the Pokemarts could be the best system. However, with the more easily accessible custom wilds, the need for these necessities may be lower now, to be fair. I also do agree about the lack of variety they sell and being overpriced. This is due to us not knowing how the new economy would function and how affordable such prices and items would be. With the results of the beta test I do agree the prices and options should be adjusted.
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Snowbreak

Perhaps the very empty department stores could get some room for chest shops instead of the pvp zone, which would end up pretty cluttered with shops.

1cec0ld

The hardest part about dealing with ChestShops is the ability to exploit them for free storage. Currently, as far as I've been able to research, there is no way to prevent someone from creating a Sell shop, or a Buy shop with some abstract item, and placing anything inside.

People have also complained about empty shops existing. Luckily, there is a configuration option for those to be broken the moment they go empty, so that would no longer be an issue.

Unless that first problem is solved however, I find it hard to convince myself that rampant Wild shops are a good idea. Allowing them inside houses which are already owned is the only way we've thought to nullify that exploit.

tenebrae

I've said this in the past, but one of the glaring flaws with the server is the economy. After buying a house, there is nothing really to spend money on. As 1ce said above, there are free storage exploits in chest shop which would be a problem in the wild.

1ce has been testing a new alternative which may be able replace chest shop but still unsure about the wild. Maybe sell vote tokens for money? But then there isn't much point in voting. It would be the same selling special items for money too. Maybe an entry fee for some automated events? This could work, but it would have to be something worth spending the money on.

Any other ideas are welcome

1cec0ld

What about End Access? But then everything in The End gets devalued.


What in a Minecraft Server has actual Value? This game is broken by design.

Everything that isn't a renewable resource (mob drops, farmable plants, etc) is either aesthetic, or a component of something renewable. Diamonds? Made into armor and weapons. Which become renewable with Mending.

The entire structure of Minecraft is to create infinite supply as the endgame is reached. Sadly, we have a bunch of experienced players, who are able to reach that point within weeks.  This devalues currency for everyone except newbies, and that's the crux of the problem.



As I think harder, there are a handful of things that veterans can't craft or renew.
We COULD rent/sell plots in the wild to be built in, much like the old Koala Treehouse or VIROS' Moon Temple and Pokeball.
We COULD sell End items at a high price, since the only way to access them now is through events or boss mobs.
We COULD rent/sell access to donor permission nodes, such as colorchat, particle effects, etc
Something I'd really like to not do is expand our house economy using doorless access a la SecretBase mechanics, but that's another thought. More Big houses = more expensive houses.

tenebrae

Quote from: 1cec0ld on Aug 16, 2019, 11:51 amWhat about End Access? But then everything in The End gets devalued.


What in a Minecraft Server has actual Value? This game is broken by design.

Everything that isn't a renewable resource (mob drops, farmable plants, etc) is either aesthetic, or a component of something renewable. Diamonds? Made into armor and weapons. Which become renewable with Mending.

The entire structure of Minecraft is to create infinite supply as the endgame is reached. Sadly, we have a bunch of experienced players, who are able to reach that point within weeks.  This devalues currency for everyone except newbies, and that's the crux of the problem.



As I think harder, there are a handful of things that veterans can't craft or renew.
We COULD rent/sell plots in the wild to be built in, much like the old Koala Treehouse or VIROS' Moon Temple and Pokeball.
We COULD sell End items at a high price, since the only way to access them now is through events or boss mobs.
We COULD rent/sell access to donor permission nodes, such as colorchat, particle effects, etc
Something I'd really like to not do is expand our house economy using doorless access a la SecretBase mechanics, but that's another thought. More Big houses = more expensive houses.

A lot of the first part is true. Most resources are renewable in some way, and a lot of things can be automated too.


As for the other points:
I would rather keep the wild a completely survival area as it is now. If special plots were to be sold, they could be in the interstitial areas between towns/routes on The Pokemon map, or even the "doorless" houses or special buildings that normally wouldn't be buyable.
Could we then also rent out pokemarts? You would still be able to access the central mart, but players could then rent a mart to sell their products in, similar to the previous pvp server.
Renting/selling access to donor perks is a good idea. It also means we could expand on the perks donators get, maybe bring back some old ones that weren't EULA compliant, if players can buy them using in game currencies.

r1579

"What in a Minecraft Server has actual Value? This game is broken by design."
to be fair, a lot of the end game renewable resources are caused by the fact the villagers themselves are op as all hell. it's very easy to amass emeralds through trade fodder and buy whatever you need (with enough time and luck). Without them, it would be a lot harder and take more effort to obtain things. The Nether is also a little op right now thanks to 1.14 mob spawns being borked which is only aiding the problem.

I don't know what to say about auto farms other then just outright ban them? Normally it would be a bad idea to set one up in the wild cause people would grief them, but there are very few on and they don't wanna create enemies. They just sit there and keep on producing materials.


"What about End Access? But then everything in The End gets devalued."
- I was figuring on saving The End for boss battles between Palkia, Dialga, and Giratina respectively. upon defeat, they drop their respective orb. collect them all and you can trade for the elytra wings through like a quest or something. I'd like to say let it be explorable , but end items should be extremely valuable and kept that way.


for ideas to spend money on, how about global mcmmo boosters? Player shells out some ingame currency to double mcmmo XP for combat/non-combat stats for a short time. the more people on, the cheaper it costs. Selling access to some commands for some convenience would also be cool (maybe like charge a fee to deposit xp into xpbank or a fee for each /tpa use?)
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